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Unsurprisingly, they are whatever they could get their hands on. Edit: Now I don't know if I should correct to "ate" or not! Edit 2: Appreciate the silver esteemed reddit colleague.
“The true paleo diet is eating whatever’s out there in the environment.”
EDIT2: I've heard it said, the diet of any culture is whatever they can catch.
So chips and fast food are the modern paleo diet? Gotcha!
Standard American hunter-gatherer diet.
Hunting = driving to a fast food restaurant drive-thru
Gathering = putting piles of prepackaged food into giant shopping carts
Hunting = trying to remember which folder you put your UberEats / Grubhub / foodler app in on your smartphone
Gathering = opening your front door to accept the delivery when it arrives
Dumpster diving. Urban paleo.
The fast food changes depending on the culture.
And at it's best, the premise of paleo is to go back to eating whatever was out there in the environment for most of our evolution, with the hope that our bodies are better evolved for that range of foods than for foods we've only been eating for 10,000 years or so.
So we should be eating mammoths and sedge roots?
You are what you eat.
So, still a person then.
Yup. We are the most opportunistic omnivores on the planet. People have survived on any kind of diet you can imagine. Mongols survived on goddamn horse blood and horse milk, and were some of the baddest dudes that ever lived.
I was reading a book about famine in North Korea. People were eating tree bark and weeds. In some other places, people eat dirt cookies. The human body is amazing.
In The Netherlands people ate tulip bulbs during the winter of '44-'45 (WWII) to survive. Apparently they taste like onions or potatoes (source)
Among other things not normally considered food, such as sugar beets and various other plants. They had stocks ready to sow, but not a chance in hell for the farmers to get it into the soil and cultivating it. So instead of letting it completely go to waste, they handed it out as bonus calories.
Apparently if you eat only around 3 tulip bulbs a day, you wont get affected by its harmful nature.
Shortly before the liberation a lot of food was dropped on Holland, and they spelled out a "thank you" with tulips to be seen from the air. Quite cool photo of it.
Do you have a link to that particular photo?
I remembered it wrong, they spelled out Many thanks
Despite the best efforts to keep the country fed via airdrops some 20,000 people died from starvation and malnutrition. The quality of the photo is not great, but the sentiment sure is.
Still amazing! Not all the dead people of course.. Thanks for the photo.
Also survival stories where people had to eat their friends or family who died. The sheer mental determination needed to do so is astounding.
The choice I could imagine is less about mental determination when you are in that situation. Our minds just go into a survival mode and much of the morality tends to disappear IMHO.
On the funny side that South Park episode where they are locked in for about an hour and then resort to cannibalism always made me laugh.
Extreme hunger will do that to you
Meh I'm about seven missed meals away from eating long pig.
Well, at a certain point the human brain will show less activity in certain parts when experiencing extreme hunger which makes it easier to consume things you wouldn't normally eat like people or tree bark.
I think that just satisfies the hunger craving though, you don't get the nutrients you need from bark, weed, and dirt and would still starve to death. Somebody more knowledgeable please correct me if I'm wrong.
The tree bark does have nutritional value. Some weeds do as well, though it depends on what. Dirt no.
Some weeds? Weeds are litter Wally (I love spellcheck) Weeds are literally perfect foods. They sprout up where ever humans disturb soil. They may not be palatable to most people now a days, but they’re packed with vitamins and minerals.
Dirt yes. Vitamins, minerals, some protein, and beneficial microflora
I saw a girl on the internet drinking horse milk, straight from the Horse. I never realised their tits were so phallic looking
Teats guys not tits.
Holy shit you weren’t kidding. Apparently there is A LOT of bestiality out there for those who are interested in that
I always just assumed bestiality porn was illegal in the US, along the same legal rationale as prohibiting child porn (a reasonable limitation on the freedom of expression which curtails 'obscene' pornography).
Turns out possession of bestiality porn is only illegal in one state! Props to Oregon for having their shit together.
Did their dental records indicate whether or not they flossed?
Using the pubes of a woolly mammoth.
Thanks for making me imagine that.
How did they brush their teeth? 👀
Some used fingers. Others used cock.
Huh, same as my ex.
For various reasons (that I don't recall), pre-agriculture humans tended to have almost no issues with losing teeth.
Little sugar, less unknown bacteria and a varied diet. They used a lot of bones, with thin splinters, to pick their teeth.
In Elizabethan England the wealthy started eating sugar regularly and their teeth rotted. People who wanted to look wealthy stained their teeth dark to make it look like their teeth were rotting.
Lol dumb fucks
No more dumb than people painting/spraying themselves brown to make themselves look like they spend more time on a beach getting their skin damaged than they actually do...
I think it proves his point really
In some places in the world it’s the opposite, they would use cosmetic products to whiten the skin, which are almost like acids, eating away layers of your skin. Unilever made (probably still) such products.
Can confirm. They have billboards all over SE Asia for those products.
Yeah, if those visionaries do it then surely there must be a reason.
One reason is they chewed a lot of roots and vegetation. Hard plants were plentiful but required a lot of chewing.
The Agricultural Revolution started with the domestication of wheat about 11,000 years ago in what is now modern-day Turkey. Since then, human beings started to substitute soft grains for hard plants. We have gotten really good at artificially selecting for genetic traits that more efficiently yield softer, more nutritious plants, as well; so, we don’t have to spend literally all day chewing plants like our ancestors did. The side effect of our ingenuity and success is the necessity for orthodontics, cardiologists, and diabetes doctors.
Source: “Sapiens” by Yuval Noah Harari
My dentist always recommends chewing sugar-free gum when possible.
While that's an interesting theory, I'd take it with a pinch of salt. Yuval seems to have a strong bias against modern agriculture, or perhaps agriculture in general.
Yes, surely a lot of the root vegetables would have been cooked...
Off-point but interesting:
Harari is only biased insofar as he argues that the pre-Ag man was a happier, healthier man. Whether or not one agrees with his argument does not change the dental records.
If not for diet, what else would cause such a decline in human dental/ortho health?
This article is mostly about dentistry but it does talk about the issue. While it is true that cavities started showing up more often around the time of the birth of agriculture, the evidence is not clear cut. Women had worse oral health than men, despite eating a similar diet, for example. So while it may not be completely wrong it's likely to be a lot more complicated than that.
As for Harari, he's a strange fellow for sure. I can't tell if he's a futurist or a luddite. On agriculture he definitely seems to be down with the anarcho-primitivists. It's a literal "back to the caves" argument.
This also explains why sometimes we get that urge to eat or chew on things while stressed or bored.
You’re saying the urge to chew while stressed is a selected trait?
There is literally no human trait that was not selected for on the African veldt. Including the inability to zipper merge.
I know you’re joking but the number of people who think every trait was selected is not insubstantial.
If you hop over to a sub like /r/evolution it's kind of scary how many questions are something like "Why does this random thing/structure/behavior exist?"
There's probably no fucking evolutionary reason why tears have salt, or we wake up to pee, or the heart is exactly where it is and not somewhere slightly different. If it doesn't actively kill you, it won't be selected against. If it doesn't actively help you, it won't be selected for. Lots of traits are just genetically linked, or even not linked, and get passed on based on other traits.
Sorry for the rant. It's way off-base in this thread. But I just get really frustrated with a seemingly large percentage of peoples' "understanding" of evolution. Like it's some mystical force that makes everything perfect for what it does. Evolution don't give a fuck. If you survive long enough to fuck and you're fertile: great, you win. That's it.
Chewing plant matter is really hard on teeth though... That's why herbivores have very large, flat teeth.
I don't understand how chewing plant matter all day could possibly be good for our teeth when it's going to cause more wear and tear.
i doubt it, fortnite isn't that old.
The audience though are mostly neanderthals.
Neandertals possibly were as smart as humans.
I read a hypothesis, that the neanderthals only went extinct, because their anatomy was unfit for throwing spears or other things. For that reason, they would always lose in a fight with a tribe of "modern" humans.
Humans are the top tier throwers in the animal kingdom. Nothing can throw as far or as precisely as we can.
Of course, sometimes this is hard to believe, when you watch [insert relevant sport team here] play [sport], hahaha!
Well, [insert relevant sports team] are obviously Neanderthals.
They actually had way better teeth than we do now because their diet didn't consist of refined starches and sugars. What you eat causes different bacterias that produce acids that actually break down your teeth and cause different digestive problems.
I will follow the Paleo diet til the day that I die. I will eat anything someone from the Paleolithic era would have, had it been made available to them. They would have loved pizza.
Right? If you could somehow tele-transport a Paleo human to the modern age, show them a pizza, and then explain how you wouldn't eat it because they didn't . . .well, I imagine they'd kill you on general principle.
Watch Encino man, that's how I imagine it going down, only with less Pauly Shore.
How dare you! He was entertaining at that time! Nobody was saying, fuck paulie shore yet
Why are people saying it now? Did he do something?
Wease the juice
Less Pauly Shore?? Sacrilegious!
Life today is less Pauly Shore and it SUCKS... BRING BACK THE WEEE-EH-EH-EH-EEEEASSLE!
To be fair, cheese can be offputting to cultures who don’t curdle milk. I remember watching an episode bizarre foods with andrew zimmern somewhere in africa and the locals thought he was insane when he offered them some type of cheese.
bread and tomatoes seem pretty universal though.
There would be no tomatoes in Europe before the Columbian exchange
I think he meant the appeal would be universal. Show a tomato to an uncontacted person who’d never seen one before and they’d probably like it, especially if you made it into sauce to put on pizza or pasta.
How ironic, given for the longest time people grew tomatoes as ornamental plants and thought the fruit were inedible.
To be fair, it took a lot of selective breeding to produce the tomato we know today. I have wild tomato on my property, and trust me whoever discovered they were edible must've been truly desperate.
Weirdly enough cheeses (especially hard cheeses like cheddar and parmesan) have a fairly low lactose content and would be fairly digestible for them compared to a cup of milk.
That was the point of cheese. It was a calorie rich super food that could be stored indefinitely and digested by people who hadn't evolved a tolerance to lactose yet. Probably first discovered somewhere around 10,000 years ago, maybe earlier. Most great cooking ideas came about from trying to preserve food without refrigeration.
Edited: words and stuff
Fermentation is a god damned miracle.
it's not about being lactose intolerant, but about cheese tasting like shit (for them)
A paleo human would most definitely have been lactose intolerant. The dominant gene allowing for digestion of milk into adulthood didn't become prevalent until about 10k years ago.
edit: nevermind, looks like someone already said that in response to parent comment. Leaving this here in case you missed that other one.
Sure, and I imagine if you brought them a dime bag of heroin they'd also make pretty good use of it. We're just starting to realise now that not everything that feels good is actually good for us - we need self control and critical thinking skills to navigate the complexities of the modern world.
They would likely have been lactose intolerant, as the ability to digest milk as adults became widespread only after (and because) we got into domestication.
So no cheese for you, on pizza or elsewhere!
cheese & yogurts are actually pretty decent for the lactose intolerant, which is why they had so much widespread success early on (that and they preserve well).
So I stand corrected, cheese is probably alright as long as it's not too much.
Ice cream is still no go, though.
Certain cheeses have more or less lactose than others, its worth a look up if you're lactose intolerant
Typically the longer it’s been aged, the more lactose has been eaten up via the ripening process. Sharper, older cheeses have less lactose. Younger sweeter cheeses have more.
Mozzarella is a young, sweet cheese. Are we back to pizza being bad for the lactose intolerant?
Yeah, but you don’t necessarily need to use mozzarella. I’ve seen a pizza that was made using an older goats cheese. It tasted great, and while I’m not lactose intolerant, my friend who also had such a pizza is, and while he’s only mildly lactose intolerant, he was fine, while he wouldn’t be okay with a normal pizza.
It was basically marketed towards the lactose intolerant, and apparently the owners kids are lactose intolerant, which explains the good menu for people who are lactose intolerant. They made great sorbet as well.
I'm not 100% sure but I thought the paleo diet wasn't about being veggie or having a specific diet that replicates a specific society, it was just about getting rid of processed foods?
Yes. When people say they eat paleo-like diet, it doesn't mean they eat mammoth meat but that they avoid processed food, and things like pasta and dairy.
avoid pasta and dairy
Over my dead body.
No wheat grains that came from agriculture so no bread or baked goods as-well. Rice for some reason is paleo though. At least according to some people. I did the whole paleo thing for about 3 months and I felt good, but it was more just sticking to a diet of healthy food rather than the actual diet thing itself. Now I am back to eating ravioli like a king.
I think most diets are as effective as eachother. It's the act of dieting - and actually paying attention to what's going in your body - that improves your wellbeing. So long as you're achieving reasonable proportions of core nutrients in a consistent calorific intake each day, your entire life will feel better.
Not to mention, I feel like agriculture played a pretty significant role in the transition from Neanderthals and the Paleolithic era to the modern era. Without agriculture, we would have nothing we have now -- no space faring, no calculus, no modern art, no ice cream, no textiles, no information technology, little language, sport etc.
Sure, maybe we wouldn't be dealing with overpopulation or climate change, but we also couldn't even fathom those ideas, much less how to combat them.
Neanderthals were long dead by the time of agriculture, and had nothing to do with it themselves.
But...ravioli is amaZing
I just heard in « Stuff you missed in history class » that researchers found samples of bread that predate agriculture. No ravioli so far, though.
The main problem with processed foods is that our darling food industry profits the opportunity to fill their products with sugar And high fructose corn syrup
Anything highly subsidized is highly profitable.
“Corn is in fucking green beans, for Christsake!”
— Lewis Black
Not to mention you can follow the Paleo diet while eating mostly meat or while being entirely vegetarian. So there's really no contradiction here.
Yeah, I have literally no idea what the title is getting at.
Same here. The article states that paleo is really just a non-carb diet, but even that is wrong. You can indulge on sweet stuff like honey when on paleo, its intent isn't to initiate and maintain ketosis.
“When people talk about the Paleo diet, that’s not paleo, that’s just non-carb,” Weyrich says. “The true paleo diet is eating whatever’s out there in the environment.”
That and there is literally no mention of carbs in the section about what the vegatarians ate. mushrooms, pine nuts, tree bark, and moss
Common misconception among people is that paleo diet = lots of meat (red meat) & fewer carbohydrates. Article/headline addressing that misconception.
Sure, but none of them were chugging Kool-Aid and eating Doritos.
Doritos were a special sometimes treat back then.
We take it for granted today, but a single Dorito chip has more extreme nacho flavor than a peasant in the 1400s would experience in his whole life.
This is actually a myth of history; peasants didn't eat doritos , but instead ate a softer, primitive version of the dish called "Great Value Nacho Triangles"
This is a whole-ass Doritos commercial compacted into a single sentence.
Are you professor Broflovski of DeVry Institute?
Cavities can take years to develop. There's a reason the baseline recommended dentist schedule is biannual cleanings and annual checkups, and it's because your teeth aren't going to fall out next week from a diet change today.
IIRC, a diet of mostly fruit is wreaking the health of some of the "healthy living" insta-girls.
It's not a good idea to ingest solely sugary stuff, even if it's not industrialized sugar.
My dental plaque shows I live on cigarettes and beer.
Breakfast of champions
Surprisingly, the article says that at least one Neanderthal ate bark containing compounds similar to aspirin to ease pain. Neanderthals knew about such things? Wow!
Paleo's benefits are largely tied to decreases in the consumption of highly processed foods and sugars/carbs. It's not that those things are evil (although sugar is pretty much our generation's cigarettes), but cutting down and seizing control of what you put in your body usually leads to a more disciplined and fulfilling diet. Processed foods don't fill you up the same way as non-processed, and sugars (carbs) provide a different, shorter-lasting source of energy as opposed to fats.
Point being, Paleo is one of many routes to land on healthier eating habits, even if the logic regarding "hurr durr man has been eating like this for ages" is pretty much a story - not science.
There's a joke among dietologists that every diet is best diet. Because it's more important to take control of what you eat and to get on some sort of diet than to choose this diet over that.
Yeah because diets make people pay attention to what they’re eating and how much they are eating. That’s the biggest thing to being healthy and losing weight.
For realsies. Compliance is HUGE.
I believe it's safe to say they didn't eat Pop Tarts.
The true paleo diet is eating whatever’s out there in the environment.”
This has always been my impression of the paleo diet. The focus is on non-processed foods. You basically just eat what nature can provide. Is that not right?
Umm, the “paleo diet” is mostly meat and vegetables.
The “paleo diet” is not meant to perfectly describe a historical diet, it’s a mental device to think about what you should eat.
FYI The whole 30 diet does not involve eating 30 whole items.
And it's not supposed to perfectly mirror a given paleolithic person, it is meant to remove things that no paleolithic person would have access to.
Yeah, some cavemen ate vegetables and some ate meat. The point is none of them ate fruit loops.
I don't follow the paleo diet, but I'm pretty sure it's not meant to replicate what another species ate in the past.
You're right. It's simply a name referencing good available before we started farming wheat. Good that hunters and gatherers ate, whether that is veggie or meat.
I did it paired with intermittent fasting.
Not really anything miraculous on paleo diets part, just made it really easy and simple to follow. Cutting out all that weird shit made it so easy to get under a caloric deficit.
Leaned out, gained strength and hit new PRs as well surprisingly. I was like 17 at the time and had already been training for a while, but I really liked the diet, helped me probably get the best physique.
It's nothing miraculous, like I said previously, but it's pretty cool and easy to follow.
Since then I've mostly been lean bulking and really limiting dairy and sugar as much as possible, as well as eating foods to try to optimize testosterone and it felt pretty good and have made good gains still.
Only thing I really hate is the snobby attitude of some always just looking down on people who follow whatever diet.
Do whatever the fuck works for you.
TIL Most redditors don't understand the Paleo Diet.
Being on reddit for about 7 years now I have come to the conclusion that, just like humans, redditors like to talk about a lot of stuff they don't understand.
It's always silly when an expert in the field gets attacked by a bunch of high-school redditors. It's the reason why /r/dontyouknowwhoiam exists.
Oh good. I literally just woke up, first thing I saw was this TIL and my brain sort of... didn't process it. Read it a few times, still wasn't making sense... Some ate mostly meat, others ate vegetables? Yeeeeah... That's totally fair game in paleo. Does Neanderthal dental plaque suggest they ate doritos and drank mountain dew like water somewhere?
I think there's a rough correlation between meat consumption and latitude, that stretches from the Paleolithic all the way to the traditional cuisine we have today. More tropical areas will have more year round access to fruits and vegetables, whereas more polar areas will have shorter and shorter growing/foraging seasons, meaning meat was a greater source of nutrition.
Of course, there are exceptions, more arid biomes near the tropics would have decreased the availability of plant based foods, and colonialism and conquest throughout history mixed up a lot of "traditional" diets.
When life gives you Mammoths, you make Mammothade!
None ate processed foods or added sugars.
The Paleo diet phase/craze was about getting people off of bread, basically. We are pretty sure these folks didn't cultivate wheat, grind it, and bake it with yeast in an oven.
On the other hand, Paleo doesn't mean you don't eat vegetables and are largely a meat-eater. When I'm strict paleo, I eat more vegetables (in calories, weight, and in volume) than I eat meat. None of this is meant to be true to form for how neanderthals lived, it's meant as a model for how to not eat a bunch of processed foods and drink alcohol all the time.
TL;DR: Veggies are Paleo.
They weren't eating cake and soda, that's the main point of a 'paleo' diet. It's not an exercise in historical reenactment.